自由時報駐美特派員曹郁芬與白宮副國安顧問Benjamin J. Rhodes 於1/29/2014在Foreign Press Center的Q & A
一
我們在1/31/2014發表了「恐懼「習馬會」、擔心歐巴馬行政團隊會賣台的台灣人與台美人應該寫信給『白宮護台特案小組首席顧問』」一文，在裡頭，我們提到也張貼了三篇與「習馬會」的議題有關的報導。
由於這些報導很值得我們台灣人與台美人鄉親的注意與關切，所以我們今天決定重新處理這些資料，同時把消息的源頭找出來，讓大家有機會知道消息來源。
這些報導的源頭是台灣的「自由時報」 的駐美特派員曹郁芬小姐與白宮副國安顧問Benjamin J. Rhodes 於1/29/2014在美國國務院Foreign Press Center的Q & A。
二
我們先張貼曹小姐的報導:
「白宮副國安顧問︰美支持兩岸對話」
自由時報
2014-01-31
〔駐美特派員曹郁芬╱華府二十九日報導〕
針對陸委會主委王郁琦二月訪問中國，以及總統馬英九期待與中國國家主席習近平舉行峰會，美國白宮副國安顧問羅茲今天表示，習馬是否舉行峰會，顯然必須在雙方同意的狀況下進行，美國支持兩岸對話，鼓勵以建設性作法來促進習主席與馬總統推動的對話。
羅茲今天在外籍記者中心就歐巴馬政策的外交政策進行簡報。他在回答王郁琦訪中可能產生的兩岸政治對話，以及習馬會的前景時表示，做為兩岸的朋友，美國希望見到兩岸對話的後果能降低緊張，追求有利於兩岸人民的連結，美國會支持兩岸繼續對話，希望能在關係進展中解決彼此的歧見。最終，如果馬習對雙方會面做出決定，美國會再評估，美國等著觀察王郁琦訪問中國的結果，但美國會繼續支持一個中國政策，並維持和台灣人民的友誼。
美國戰略暨國際研究中心資深顧問張克斯受訪時表示，就他與兩岸接觸的觀察，台海兩岸其實對習馬會都有興趣，如果成真對整個區域都有重大意義，但要做到並不容易。習馬會的條件是最難的部分，門檻會很高，台北很在意馬英九會受到什麼樣的待遇，對北京也是很大挑戰。
張克斯說，習近平和整個中共體系都想看到台海問題有進展，尤其是涉及主權的核心議題，當然這要考慮到台灣的敏感性，馬的支持率低，台灣的年底又要選舉，如果民進黨二○一六勝選機率大，可能會讓北京想急著鞏固與馬達成的兩岸談判成果。 至於美方是否樂見王郁琦赴中國展開兩岸政治對話，張克斯認為，美方會讓兩岸自行決定，美方向來就鼓勵兩岸採取任何能降低緊張的交流和對話。
曹小姐的報導不只提到白宮副國安顧問Benjamin J. Rhodes的談話，也提及美國「戰略暨國際研究中心」的資深顧問張克斯 (Christopher K. Johnson, Senior Advisor & Freeman Chair in China Studies, CSIS)。
自由時報的姊妹報The Taipei Times在華盛頓的特派員William Lowther 也根據曹郁芬與Benjamin J. Rhodes之間的對話做了報導。
“US official skirts around issue of a Ma-Xi meeting”
‘CONSTRUCTIVE’:：A US foreign policy aide said that the White House supports cross-strait dialogue and efforts to reduce tensions
By William Lowther / Staff reporter in WASHINGTON
The Taipei Times
Fri, Jan 31, 2014 - Page 2
A top foreign policy aide to US President Barack Obama on Wednesday refused to comment on a possible meeting between President Ma Ying-jeou (馬英九) and Chinese President Xi Jinping (習近平).
Deputy National Security Adviser for Strategic Communications Ben Rhodes danced around the question, giving little indication of the White House’s reaction. Nevertheless, it was the first time the Obama administration had publicly addressed the possible meeting.
Rhodes was asked at a conference in the US Department of State’s Foreign Press Center how the Obama administration viewed the prospect of a “summit” or meeting between Xi and Ma.
“That is something that both sides would have to agree to,” he said. “We have, as a general matter, supported cross-strait dialogue.”
He said the US had encouraged the “constructive approach” that Ma and Xi had brought to the dialogue.
“As a friend to both sides, what we would want to see is an outcome that reduces any tension across the Strait and that pursues closer ties that benefit both the people of Taiwan and the People’s Republic of China,” Rhodes said.
He had been reminded by the questioner at the conference that Mainland Affairs Council Minister Wang Yu-chi (王郁琦) and Taiwan Affairs Office Director Zhang Zhijun (張志軍) were scheduled to meet in Nanjing on Feb. 11 and that there was speculation that the meeting could lead to a Ma-Xi summit later in the year.
“The US will continue to support cross-strait dialogue, to see it advance and evolve over time, to see it address the different facets of the relationship,” Rhodes said.
If Ma and Xi decided to meet, “that is something we will have to review at the time,” he said.
“We will await to see the outcome of those talks,” he said.
“In the meantime, we will continue our long-standing practice of supporting a one China policy, maintaining our friendship with the people of Taiwan and seeking to support dialogue across the Strait,” he said.
三
我們現在把這些報導的源頭----------曹郁芬小姐與白宮副國安顧問Benjamin J. Rhodes 於1/29/2014在美國國務院Foreign Press Center的Q & A-------找出來，也就是說，我們要把官方就Rhodes在Foreign Press Center所發表的談話加以整理與發表的正式文件找出來，不過，我們只張貼我們想要的部分。
"U.S. Official on Obama Foreign Policy Priorities for 2014"
29 January 2014
http://iipdigital.usembassy.gov/st/english/texttrans/2014/01/20140130291890.html#ixzz2s8A4Pflb
FOREIGN PRESS CENTER BRIEFING WITH BEN RHODES, DEPUTY NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR FOR STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS
TOPIC: 2014 FOREIGN POLICY PRIORITIES FOR THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION
WEDNESDAY, JANUARY 29, 2014, 4:00 P.M. EST
THE WASHINGTON FOREIGN PRESS CENTER, WASHINGTON, D.C.
MR. RHODES: Thanks. Thanks, everybody. It’s really good to be back here at the Foreign Press Center. Let me just begin by giving a brief overview of what the President talked about in the State of the Union, elaborate on that a little bit, some of the upcoming events we’re focused on, and then take your questions.
[Ben Rhodes的談話因與台灣、日本、中國均無關，故全部予以刪除]
[他接著接受外國媒體記者提問，我們把與台灣、日本、中國無關的Q & A全部予以刪除]
QUESTION: Thank you very much. Donghui Yu with China Review News Agency. Is the White House arranging another summit between President Obama and President Xi? Because we have seen news reporting that the two presidents may have meetings on the sideline of the nuclear summit in March. Could you please confirm that? How necessary do you think for the two presidents to meet again after last June summit (inaudible)? Thank you.
MR. RHODES: Yeah. Well, it’s a good question. We have not locked in and scheduled meetings with the Chinese president. However, were he to be at The Hague at the same time as President Obama, I think we would certainly make it a priority for President Obama and President Xi to see each other at The Hague. We believe it’s important to have regular consultations at a high level, including the level of the presidents, to keep the U.S.-China relationship moving forward.
I think the two leaders set out a very broad agenda at Sunnylands. That included our continued dialogue on economic issues where we share a lot of common interests and have occasional differences. At the same time, if you look at the other challenges we’re facing, U.S.-China cooperation is essential. So, for instance, on the Iran negotiations, China has been with us in the P5+1. On North Korea, we sought to increase our collaboration with China to avoid destabilization and pursue denuclearization on the peninsula. Beyond that, we’ve had a number of discussions about maritime security, how to avoid any provocative actions or inadvertent escalation in relation to territorial disputes, and what the U.S. has sought to do is reinforce clear rules of the road and peaceful dialogue for resolving these issues. That, I think, would be an area of natural discussion for the two presidents.
So there’s a very broad agenda. I expect that they’d be able to address that at the Nuclear Security Summit, provided they have time to see each other on the sidelines there. And we’ll make sure that they’re continuing regular interactions throughout the course of the year.
QUESTION: Thanks, Ben. Ching-Yi Chang of Phoenix TV, Hong Kong. Yesterday, Japan’s Kyodo News reported that actually Vice President Biden told Japanese Prime Minister Abe, before he visited the controversial shrine, and they had tense conversation, and in the end the Vice President didn’t persuade Abe not to go to the shrine. And so is the President aware of Prime Minister Abe’s recent move? And if so, how concerned he is about the recent standoff among Japan and its neighbors? Thank you.
MR. RHODES: Well, we expressed disappointment in the decision to visit the shrine at the time. Obviously, every country and every leader, as I said in other cases here today, makes their own determinations about what to do. However, I think as a general matter, in the Asia Pacific region, we have counseled Japan, Korea – the Republic of Korea, China, to show some sensitivity to the very significant historical concerns that underpin a lot of these issues. Of course, everybody’s going to have their own views, but I think it’s important that there is respect for that history and the actions that are taken, and that’s what’s guided our approach.
And I think it’s particularly true at a time when, look, there are very difficult issues that are being worked through in the region. And we see heightened tensions at times, particularly over territorial disputes. Ultimately, those issues can only be resolved through a process of peaceful dialogue. And peaceful dialogue is facilitated when, I think, leaders take that extra step to try to reduce tensions.
And we’ve seen rhetoric from all sides that, at times, has fed tensions instead of trying to keep them down. As a general matter, whether it’s China and Japan working through their issues on the Senkakus, for instance, or whether it’s our allies, partners in Korea and Japan, we’d like to see, again, a constructive approach taken so that these issues can be dealt with through dialogue, historical concerns can be dealt with through sensitivity, and everybody can basically understand that we all benefit if the region is more stable, if there’s not the risk of escalation and inadvertent conflict.
And again, we’ve seen steps taken by different leaders at different times, different nations at different times, that have not advanced that principle. When we see that, we have spoken out about it. But as a general matter, I think the U.S. sees our role as supporting our allies, of course, which is a constant in our foreign policy, and then also trying to work through ways to reduce tensions.
Let’s see. I want to make sure I’m getting some geographical – yes, the gentleman here in the – with the beard.
QUESTION: [自由時報駐美特派員曹郁芬發問],
MR. RHODES: [Rhodes回答，我不加以翻譯，因為大家若讀上面曹郁芬的報導，就會明白] Well, when it comes to the question of a summit between the two leaders, that is something that obviously the – both sides would have to agree to. We have, as a general matter, supported cross-strait dialogue. We’ve encouraged the constructive approach that’s been taken to that dialogue by both President Xi and President Ma. As a friend to both sides, I think what we want to see is an outcome that, again, reduces any tension across the strait, and that I think pursues closer ties that benefit both the people of Taiwan and the people of the People’s Republic of China.
So I think as a general matter, the U.S. will continue to support cross-strait dialogue to see it advance and evolve over time, to see it address the different facets of the relationship across the straits. And ultimately, if that judgment is made by the leaders, that’s something we’d have to review at the time, and so we’ll await to see the outcome of those talks. In the meantime, we’ll continue our longstanding practice of supporting a One China policy, maintaining our friendship with the people and leaders of Taiwan as well in seeking to support dialogue cross-straits.
[雖然我們台灣人與台美人要對美國政府的對台政策與作為保持密切的觀察與高度的警覺，不能大意與鬆懈，但就這段談話來說，我們實在看不出歐巴馬團隊準備放棄或出賣台灣或台灣人。第一，Rhodes繼續使用美國政府使用的關鍵字，即dialogue，而非negotiation。第二，他所理解的「台海兩岸的對話」，目的是為了”reduces any tension across the strait”以及”pursues closer ties that benefit both the people of Taiwan and the people of the People’s Republic of China”。第三，他稱雙方的領導人是President Xi and President Ma。第四，他說「台海兩岸的對話」是為了"address the different facets of the relationship across the straits"， 但美國保留了「審視或審核雙方領導人所做出的判斷」的權力(“And ultimately, if that judgment is made by the leaders, that’s something we’d have to review at the time”。第五，Rhodes雖然行禮如儀地提”One China Policy”， 可是他說的是”we’ll continue our longstanding practice of supporting a One China policy, maintaining our friendship with the people and leaders of Taiwan as well in seeking to support dialogue cross-straits”。任何對「美國的一中政策」有深入研究的人都知道，美國歷任政府經常掛在嘴邊的”One China Policy”是”Our One-China Policy”，它是有特殊意含的名詞，它與「台北的一中原則」或「北京的一中原則」都不同，而且可以說，美國的「我們的一中政策」其中一個要素是「台灣的主權不屬於中國」。]
QUESTION: Will the President be visiting Japan in April? And if so, what will be the topics of his meetings there?
MR. RHODES: Well, we haven’t made any particular announcements about the stops on our April trip to Asia. I will say though that the President is committed to going to Japan as a general matter. So I’m certain that he’ll be returning there as President and we’d like to do that as soon as we can. So we’ll give additional announcements on stops as we have them.
In terms of the agenda, I think that we see with Japan right now, first of all on the economic side, clearly TPP is front and center, and I think what we’ve seen is a lot of progress made in the TPP negotiations. As is the case with any trade negotiation, the last issues are the hardest issues and raise significant challenges domestically in all countries involved. And so we’re now dealing with those final issues. We believe as a general matter, it’s very good for Japan to be a part of TPP, and we’re going to continue to try to work through the outstanding issues on TPP with the Japanese and the other countries involved.
I think in terms of security, our alliance issues are always front and center. We believe that the alliance is very strong. There’s strong public support in both countries, there’s good cooperation. We’d like to see continued progress made in resolving the Futenma issue, for instance, and we’ve seen some movement forward there, and that’s a part of the broader modernization of the alliance, and so that will continue to be a topic. I think as it relates to regional security, we share concerns with North Korea’s provocative behavior and share the goal of denuclearization on the peninsula, so I’m sure that North Korea would be an agenda item.
And of course, in the general regional environment, we have encouraged efforts, again, to reduce tensions and promote dialogue. Obviously, we stand from – we start from the standpoint that we support our ally, Japan, in their security. But as a general matter, we believe regional stability would be enhanced, including Japanese security efforts are taken to reduce those tensions.
So there’s a broad security dialogue, a broad economic dialogue that we would have with the Japanese. Again, I think as a general matter, it’s one of our most important relationships in the world. We have a very prominent ambassador there now in Caroline Kennedy, who is also a very close, personal friend of the President’s. And so I think he would look forward to being able to travel there and we’d have no shortage of issues to discuss.
QUESTION: Thank you so much. I’m Wei Xing from China Central Television. My first question – want to follow up the Yasukuni Shrine thing. We know that after the Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe’s visit the Yasukuni Shrine, and the United States sent three top officials to that area – for example, William Burns and Daniel Russel. So is that – as some commenters say, (inaudible) the Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe’s foreign policy is contradictory with American foreign policy in that region. So what is your comments on that?
And my second question is related to China. As we know, the China-U.S. is trying to build new, modern relationships. So how do you see in 2014 the relationship between China and the U.S.? Thank you so much.
MR. RHODES: Look, I think with respect to Japan, frankly, we are aligned with the Japanese on many issues in the region. The U.S.-Japan alliance is always going to be a cornerstone of our approach to the Asia Pacific. And ultimately, it’s been very good for the prosperity of the region. It’s facilitated trade and commerce. It has benefited the whole neighborhood, I think including China.
And on security issues, if you look at the key issues, whether it’s counter-proliferation, denuclearization on the Korean Peninsula, Japan’s support for certain aspects of our efforts in Afghanistan, on development, the bottom line is we are very aligned with Japan in our interests and we cooperate very closely. That doesn’t mean from time to time we’re not going to have occasional differences. And I think the goals are the same, though. The goals are a secure Japan, a secure and stable Asia Pacific region, good relations ultimately between Japan and its neighbors. And so that’s the type of message that I’m sure Danny Russel, Bill Burns, and others were discussing with the Japanese.
With respect to China in 2014, again, I think that North Korea and Iran, key nonproliferation challenges will be key parts of our agenda.
Our trade and economic relationship is very broad and intertwined. I think we’ll want to continue our discussions on those issues.
Cyber security, we’ve initiated this dialogue, and I think we’ll continue to be able to talk to China about some of our concerns on cyber issues, particularly as it relates to intellectual property.
But maritime security, I think, will continue to be an issue. And there, again, what we’ve said is if you take an issue like the South China Sea, the U.S. is not a claimant, but we also believe that there should not be unilateral actions that seek to change facts on the ground or resolve these issues other than through dialogue and through multilateral established processes to adjudicate claims. So I think we’ll continue to discuss that agenda as well.
QUESTION: Thank you. In his State of the Union Address, the President said, “We will continue to focus on Asia Pacific.” He did not use “pivot” or “rebalance.” Is there any deliberation in his choice of words? Thank you.
MR. RHODES: Yes.
MS. BROWN: Could you just tell us your outlet, please?
QUESTION: Aijun Yi with China’s Xinhua News Agency.
MR. RHODES: Yes. Well, look, I wouldn’t – I would not read anything into that. Rebalance, I think, is how we would describe the policy precisely because what we’re doing is we’re rebalancing our prioritization and resources in the world as we wind down the wars. So we’re rebalancing our economic focus through TPP. We’re rebalancing some of our securities through our defense budget, through our defense relationships. And we’re rebalancing through some of the people-to-people ties that we’ll be expanding this year, and we’re launching some exchange programs in the region. So I think rebalance speaks to this process of making sure that the U.S. is appropriately postured for the 21st century with the Asia Pacific as an emerging region. And so that, I think, would continue to be a good description of our policy.
QUESTION: Han Yuan Liao from China News Service. I’ve got two questions on Japan-China. First question: Does the U.S. accept Japanese Prime Minister Abe to visit Yasukuni shrine again, or do you opposed it?
Second question about China’s new national security commission: Last week, China decided that President Xi Jinping will be the chairman of the country’s national security commission. And the meanwhile, Premier Li Keqiang will be deputy head of this commission. So this is a very high-level commission. I want to know how do you comment this. And how do you see the cooperation between U.S.-China in this field, I mean, between the national security authorities? Thank you.
MR. RHODES: Well, on the first question, look, I think our general principle on these issues, as I said, is that all leaders should demonstrate a degree of sensitivity to historical concerns. So I don’t want to speculate about hypotheticals or things that haven’t happened yet, but that’s been our baseline.
With respect to the Chinese leadership, I think our view has been that it’s important for the United States to have contacts across China’s leadership, that President Obama, has a relationship with Xi Jinping, but in the past he’s engaged with the Chinese premier. The Strategic and Economic Dialogue allows our officials to engage through State and Treasury here and the appropriate ministries in China. We’ve enhanced military-to-military ties – the point being that the relationship is so big and complicated and has so many issues at stake that we want to engage all of the various actors in the Chinese system. And clearly, the Chinese are, as they’ve consolidated their leadership transition, are putting people into these different specific positions. We will adjust our engagement appropriately so that we have lines of communication on a very regular basis.
台灣建州運動發起人周威霖
Founder, Formosa Statehood Movement
(an organization devoted in current stage to making Taiwan a territorial commonwealth of the United States)
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